we believe absurdities,
we shall commit atrocities." Odi profanum vulgus et
For Your Information in re the
ME: On trolling the Phoenix Forums
Yesterday, on Dutch Commemoration Day of WW II - see:
- I showed all that the world may not see according to
Mark the Moderator, who also saw fit to edit my texts, as if he has a
right thereto, knowing full well I had asked them to delete them, if he
doesn't want them, for the sake of the Phoenix Forums, though grossly
unjust and unfair given all the personal opinions of all manner of
anonymous folks on the forums, for this wholly anonymous person (who
wrote me - in my opinion - rather insane PMs, by the by, insists on this,
again and again and again, so I nicely copied this for you
Moderator Note: Some content here was deleted because parts of it
were felt to be offensive to Dutch forum members.
Then, after Mark the moderator had done that, I got this, on May 4,
after he learned about my family's heroism in WW II and my personal
From honest Mark, with all the best respect:
Hi, just to say sorry I failed to respond by EM within the
'memorial' period, a stressful one for you, as I now understand.
Perhaps some small regrets over intervening, I could have tried 'do
nothing' perhaps, but I will reflect on this.
Would it be fair to say: as a humane being, spiritual healing of mm
remains impossible in the absence of honest understanding of history?
The honour of such a position appears breathtaking to me. I can but
Also, I had some strange thoughts yesterday...we should probably
discuss circumcision and the potential uses of what has been removed -
privately, preferably...a sore point...
All the best,
From someone who sent me just plain crazy private mails, that made me
fear for his mental health, and then was suddenly made moderator, I do
not know on the basis of what personal excellencies in his private life,
for had he knew me personally or knew where I could find him personally,
obviously he would not have written thus offensively - but OK, maybe he is S.W. and has a hang-up on the issue or works for KCL. If indeed
he is compos mentis... (*)
Having received that on May 4, I woke up on May 5 to the
following piece of creepy Uriah Heep impertinent insanity. Incidentally:
Everything he says is craftily false and misleading, and as such worthy
for informal logic books: I had not personally attacked him - apart from
offering him a treatment on my site, after reading he arrogated himself
the rights to reopen the LP-discussion AND the insane premisses of
RESPECTFULNESS to His Bobness and co-workers - and after asking him at
least 5 times what his qualifications are:
A few people have told me that you are a decent member of the
You have been so unreasonable towards me that I can't quite see
this myself... but I will take into account the fact that this
particular subject raises strong emotions, for many of us, before I
form an opinion of you.
I think that your personal attacks have perfectly demonstrated the
point I was originally making...
You saw someone who disagreed with your own views, and you attacked
me personally, rather than discussing and arguing the issues...
I assume that you would do this with anyone who disagreed with your
And would you would do this to anyone who said that they had
benefited from LP?
It is very unpleasant to be on the receiving end of a personal
And my original point was that I believe this sort of behaviour
will not progress our cause...
If you just attack someone because you disagree with them, but
refuse to address the issues intelligently and courteously, then
you just come across as ignorant, and people will not listen to you
or take you seriously. So it does nothing for your cause.
I remain of the view that we should address the issues, and not
attack individual people.
You have refused to enter into a discussion with me, and you
haven't raised any specific issues of debate with me, but you have
just continuously attacked me instead. It is a very sorry way to
conduct a discussion.
I stick firm to the belief that we shouldn't personally attack
people who we disagree with, however passionate we are about a
If you personally attack someone just because you disagree with
their point of view, then you immediately lose the argument.
I just insisted on knowing anything about what makes him qualified to
argue this - after it has been disposed of already, by very able persons,
who write much better than he, and at least have some scientific degrees
and evident intellectual capacity and know-how.
But no, what I get is the above raving BS, in reply to repeated
questions for relevant qualifications...
And all this from a totally unknown quantity on the forums, who I did
not even know existed there in its nooks and crannies,
presumably respectfully salving ill members with respect, sucking for information,
who got it in his dense or evil brain that HE, of all people, is entitled
to ONCE MORE, after LP had been very ably and cogently dished as
utter crap, by at least 7 FAR more capable, better writing and more
scientifically qualified persons that this Bob-Heep of Uriahness, and
that LP is very dangerous, for people with ME and in general, to
"objectively, from all sides, seriously, scientifically" but
RESPECTFULLY (to him, he means), which means especially that
this psychologist and logical philosopher is
not even allowed to
inquire after the gentleman's good faith, website, academic
qualifications, age, position in life, outlook or what not:
DISRESPECTFUL, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN: Bob the LP-Genius - who of course
pretends he is agin', but wants therefore, and on that pretention, of his
anonymous self, that nobody seems to know, again and again and again,
sycophantic soft soap in one RESPECTFUL hand, and Mother Hubbard's
Cathechism for Conmanship in the other - exercise in extensive
RESPECTFUL debate about the RESPECTFUL merits and demerits -
"without being personal", mind you, for then you may be found out - of a
brainwashing therapy for genuinely ill people, and in particular
For - don'tcha suckers all see - one must be RESPECTFUL here,
and RESPECTFULLY see both sides of the question, and be
RESPECTFUL about the claims of LP-therapists and brainwashed acolytes
that there form of mindrot has cured them of all ills. One must see both
sides of it, according to him.
As a psychologist or philosopher I should shut up, whines and weedles
the Uriah Bob Heep, the RESPECTFULNESS demanding LP-creep, to the
public, for I dare being critical of his mode of procedure, thereby
clearly proving that I do not have RESPECT for that most humbly
most best of all human beings, RESPECTFULLY in possession of the
rights on how to debate an issue, and - like CDC and KCL - carefully
selecting the cohort of members of the forums that RESPECTFULLY
swallow his artfully prepared very respectful and alluring bait...
I have in the 60 years of my life received quite a few impertint,
shitty, malignant, dishonest and other sorts of sick letters and posts
(always by either anonymous or functionally anonymous bureaucrats and
politicians, as it happens: Personally, by people I know or knew, I have
NEVER been thus spoken or written to) but this is the absolute crown of
... thanks to the Moderation Practiced on Phoenix Forums, yea verily.
Thank you, Bob! You Are A Great, Brave And Noble Man! Anybody who
tells you differently is just DISRESPECTFULL to you, so there...
There it stands, in fact on May 6, 2010 and not on May 5, because Cort
Johnson, the owner of the Phoenix Forums, just seems too pre-occupied
with the many good things he does, to mind this sort of thing,
although he superficially sort of signalled he knows about it.
So for once Nederlog is antedated, and the Nederlog of May 6, the next
in the series, may arrive fast, if Cort still is asleep or not prepared
to make choices, or may not appear at all or later, if there comes, at
long last, some sort of answer as to whether the above sort of stances
are the right and proper thing, by anonymous members of the forum, to me.
Incidentally: I have been here before, several times: Who stands
out in a crowd gets followed or gets problems.
If this manner of men, as detailed above, have or get the effective
say-so about the Phoenix Forums... well: I shall be having some rather
sharp things to say about that, for in fact I feel more or less like
Prometheus may have felt when savaged by rats, while bound.
And this is in fact one of THE problems of the internet: Where
folks gather anonymously, there be trolls, suckers, motherfuckers and
idiots mixed in, in much larger proportion than in face-to-face basis,
for functional anonymity makes the sadist's, creep's or plain malevolent
dumb idiot-with-a-swollen-ego's heart only beat all the fonder, with
ever more RESPECT for the
opportunities offered and for the suckers they hope to prey on.
Thus it is, and thus is cannot be on a GOOD patients' forum, as
I will proceed to explain, on this place, in the time coming, in which I
will anyway do much more for my site and much less for Phoenix Rising.
For the present, you may take it that I have asked the landlord there
politely and friendly, and quite a few times also now, to do something
about a pair of atrociously behaving anonymous customers of his who, if
not insanely drunk, or otherwise mentally challenged, seem out to do harm
or propel and popularize dangerous nonsense in a RESPECTFUL show of
"objective seeing of both sides".
Why not start that procedure again - if it is possible with LP - with
the Wessely-teachings? One must be RESPECTFUL and scienteefeecally
discuss "both sides", doesn't one? Maoism, LP, Voodoo, Graduated Exercise
Therapy, Cognitive Behaviour Therapy... c'mon: Wesselite teachings too,
but PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE FOLKS: RESPECTFULLY as per the brilliant and
learned Bob's objective, evenhanded, honorable, informed, rational,
In fact, I do not know the abovementioned gentlemen at all: their faces and identities are a mystery, as are their motives and
real capacities and masters. And they think they can get away with
anything, simply because they are functionally anonymous...
Deeper explanations - incidentally not very different in
principle or content from what many religious prophets taught, ye
may be amazed to learn, RESPECTFULLY also, are here (and Jesus
should have been more polite and RESPECTFUL with those money-exchangers, don't you
see, while Jesus' "Lord forgive them, for they don't know what they are
doing" was VERY DISRESPECTFULL, Bob, of all people and especially
of the onlookers: arrogant sort geezer He must have been, not to
let himself crucify peaceably and RESPECFULLY):
And by the way: If this is not good for the Phoenix forums, I
am sorry, but I am personally not going to be abused as above, not
being a masochist and not being a PC ordinary guy, and not without making
clear in graphic detail what I think are the reasons for this: They both
owe it quite to themselves. The first should have done as we
agreed, but chose not to; the second should have said, politely
also, what makes him so qualified to reopen the rotting stomach of a
horse 7 times flogged to death by far more capable writers and reasoners
than he is, or poses as he is, but chose not to AND write
the above piece of...
... reserved for later issues of Nederlog!